In anticipation of the longest government shutdown in U.S. history finally ending, MSNBC’s Katy Tur couldn’t let it end without degrading President Trump one last time, pointing to the mass-firings of federal employees and withholding of SNAP benefits as evidence of “callousness.”
Tur believed that, “… the shutdown did reveal quite a dark side of Donald Trump. I mean, posting about the grim reaper coming to slash government jobs, laying off workers, just wait. Suing states to say, ‘No, you can’t release these SNAP funds.’”
She then suggested that Trump used to be more sympathetic and manipulable under emotional pressure:
There was a certain callousness that went further than I’ve seen Donald Trump go in the past. Usually when he’s presented with suffering, or in the past when he had been presented with suffering, he’s folded…
Prompted by Tur, staff writer for The Atlantic Ashley Parker emphasized how much the President must have enjoyed punishing others during the shutdown:
TUR: Am I wrong to say that there’s a change there? Has there been an evolution or devolution?
PARKER: Part of what it revealed is what we’ve long known, Katie, which is his sort of gleeful exuberance of, you know, “We’re gonna make cuts to Democratic projects and Democratic states. We’re gonna lay off the federal bureaucrats who we don’t like anyhow.” I think that’s less of a revelation for students of the President and more of an underscoring that this is not Barack Obama, “There’s no red states and blue states. There’s just purple states in a unified American.” He’s always made clear that he views himself as the President for his supporters.
Parker went on to support Tur’s theory of Trump’s former vulnerability: “It’s interesting what you said about when he is faced with suffering, he often folds. I think that’s right. But it’s often visual pictures […] of suffering, the sort of suffering you see in a war, in a strike. Sometimes even in immigration detention facilities.”
Well, not getting free money for food or not working for the federal government (which were paid for by you, dear reader) weren’t remotely as destitute as either of those examples. Maybe it’s time to wean America off of the welfare state.
The transcript is below. Click “expand” to read:
MSNBC’s Katy Tur Reports
November 12, 2025
3:25:58 p.m. EST
(…)
KATY TUR: So, Ashley, we talked about this a little bit earlier, and I’d love you to weigh in on this as well, the shutdown did reveal quite a dark side of Donald Trump. I mean, posting about the grim reaper coming to slash government jobs, laying off workers, just wait. Suing states to say, “No, you can’t release these SNAP funds.” Arguing that the people that are really hurting from this or should be punished during the shutdown are Democrats, even though when you look at the maps, the people that enjoy the SNAP benefits, or people that need the SNAP benefits or people that need the ACA subsidies largely come from — come from everywhere, but there’s a big concentration in the deep red states.
There was a certain callousness that went further than I’ve seen Donald Trump go in the past. Usually when he’s presented with suffering, or in the past when he had been presented with suffering, he’s folded, which is why I thought the Democrats might have a chance to get him at some point to force the Republicans to vote on an extension of these subsidies. Am I wrong to say that there’s a change there? Has there been an evolution or devolution?
ASHLEY PARKER: Well, it’s interesting. Part of what it revealed is what we’ve long known, Katie, which is his sort of gleeful exuberance of, you know, “We’re gonna make cuts to Democratic projects and Democratic states. We’re gonna lay off the federal bureaucrats who we don’t like anyhow.” I think that’s less of a revelation for students of the President and more of an underscoring that this is not Barack Obama, “There’s no red states and blue states. There’s just purple states in a unified American.” He’s always made clear that he views himself as the President for his supporters.
What is perhaps more surprising, some of the stuff like the Affordable Care Act, the premiums, the subsidies, that’s something that is going to hurt his supporters as much as anyone else. Same with the SNAP benefits. It’s interesting what you said about when he is faced with suffering, he often folds. I think that’s right. But it’s often visual pictures —
TUR: Yeah.
PARKER: — of suffering, the sort of suffering you see in a war, in a strike. Sometimes even in immigration detention facilities. But I wondered, to your question, I don’t know the answer, some of these premiums that there’s not sort of a photo image or a TV image that captures someone like you played in that phone call, whose premiums, whose healthcare is now gonna cost more than their salary. And that might be the disconnect that you’re articulating, Katie.
(…)
